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Pellet Testing... AGAIN!
http://targettalk.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=51440
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Author:  Wynne G Oldman [ Thu Feb 18, 2016 8:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Thanks for that RMCA, very interesting.

Author:  chris weidenfeller [ Tue Mar 01, 2016 9:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

In my IZH 46m I find that Daisy Precision Max flat nose pellets shoot very good. Match grade for you guys, probably not. But at 3.99 plus tax per 500 here in Iowa I really like them. From my bench with a sand bag rest 10 meters .33 ten shot groups. Took the IZH to bullseye pistol range and at 50 feet ten shot 1/2 inch groups from a sand bag rest. I have tried 7 or 8 different pellets so far, my next purchase is basics in green tin. I don't think for the price difference that I will be shooting anything but Daisy P Max. My shooting ability is what is keeping my score low. Its not the arrows but the Indian.

Author:  kevinweiho [ Tue Mar 01, 2016 11:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

chris weidenfeller wrote:
In my IZH 46m I find that Daisy Precision Max flat nose pellets shoot very good.

My Izzy also likes the Precision Max pellets, but they leave my fingers and the barrel dirty in no time. I'd rather use the Basics or H&N pellets. However, these inexpensive pellets gets used up more than my expensive pellets!

Author:  chris weidenfeller [ Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

I sometimes wash them. Then a couple of drops of light oil in the tin.

Author:  Sa-tevo [ Tue Mar 29, 2016 2:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

rmca wrote:
The group is pretty similar to the H&N Finale Match Pistol 7.56gr 4.49 I´ve tested two years ago.


rmca,
When you tested were you able to compare 4.49 with 4.5? I ask as my Steyr shoots 4.5 well in my makeshift vice rig with H&N Match Rifle 4.5 about 1mm bigger, but I haven't had a chance to try 4.49.

Of course, after testing, I found that the proprietor of this website was correct about pistol pellet testing. Kind of like my Bullseye coach saying Ransom Rest testing has limited value when he can pick up my pistols/ammo and shoot up the ten ring at 50 yards. "Dry fire and practice, quit testing. Don't worry about testing."

Author:  rmca [ Tue Mar 29, 2016 2:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Sa-tevo wrote:
When you tested were you able to compare 4.49 with 4.5? I ask as my Steyr shoots 4.5 well in my makeshift vice rig with H&N Match Rifle 4.5 about 1mm bigger, but I haven't had a chance to try 4.49.

I have tested the H&N Final Match Pistol in the 4.49 and 4.5 version two years ago, and the results here similar to the RWS R10 Pistol. Not much difference between the two.

From my experience, the lighter the pellet, the better the group. The 7gr (or near) pellets always out performed the heavier rifle pellets (around 8.4gr) in my pistol. The difference is around 1 to 2 mm larger groups, from memory. That test was two years ago, so I will have to dig to find the paperwork on that... ;)

Once you get to test top of the line pellets, the differences are pretty minor. I knew the R10 would perform better, but what I wanted to know with this test was how the cheaper pellets performed.

And yes, to some it's a waste of time, but to me it's peace of mind and confidence in my equipment, which are priceless in competition. And a single test every two years doesn't replace that much training... :)

Hope this helps

Author:  Sa-tevo [ Tue Mar 29, 2016 2:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

rmca wrote:
[
I have tested the H&N Final Match Pistol in the 4.49 and 4.5 version two years ago, and the results here similar to the RWS R10 Pistol. Not much difference between the two.

From my experience, the lighter the pellet, the better the group. The 7gr (or near) pellets always out performed the heavier rifle pellets (around 8.4gr) in my pistol. The difference is around 1 to 2 mm larger groups, from memory. That test was two years ago, so I will have to dig to find the paperwork on that... ;)


Great info, good enough for me. I had to test to see if my new-to-me LP10E wasn't shooting sideways now that the new models are out. Getting usable test results with the pellets I had on hand is a confidence builder. Thanks.

Author:  rmca [ Tue Mar 29, 2016 3:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Sa-tevo wrote:
...I had to test to see if my new-to-me LP10E wasn't shooting sideways now that the new models are out...

Attention! This test was made BEFORE the Evo10 debut...
I'm afraid to retest mine now... ;)

Author:  Rover [ Tue Mar 29, 2016 4:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Come on! You know that every gun previous to the EVO10 is useless trash to be peddled to unknowing newbies. Sip that Kool-Ade!

Author:  Andre [ Tue Mar 29, 2016 5:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Rover wrote:
BTW I clamp my LP1 by the trigger guard, as recommended by Steyr. I was always afraid of crushing the cylinder.


That cylinder is holding 3,000 PSI. If your vise is clamping the cylinder hard enough to deform it under the immense pressure inside, you must have some monster vise!

Author:  Sa-tevo [ Tue Mar 29, 2016 5:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Rover wrote:
Come on! You know that every gun previous to the EVO10 is useless trash to be peddled to unknowing newbies. Sip that Kool-Ade!


Don't you have some clouds that you should be yelling at?

Author:  rmca [ Wed Mar 30, 2016 7:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Rover wrote:
Come on! You know that every gun previous to the EVO10 is useless trash to be peddled to unknowing newbies. Sip that Kool-Ade!

Rover,

using your own logic, now that the EVO10 is the new kid on the block, the LP10 can no longer be Kool-Ade!
It hasn't got to the "beer status" of the FWB 65 or Pardini K58 yet, but it has left the Kool-Ade label... "There's no room for two pistols in this town..."

Now you can start looking for one! And join the dark side... (or silver if you have good taste!)

Author:  X10 [ Thu Mar 31, 2016 3:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

That is what I will do. I will sit back and wait for all the Kool-Ade-drinkers to dump their LP10s on the marked. And I will pick up a "like new" one for cheap.

I dont think an EVO10 is going to make me a better shot :-)

When I get to the point where I can put all the pellets in the 10 ring I might upgrade in the hopes of getting them all in the X10 ring :-) Like that is ever going to be my problem. Happy shooting

Author:  Rover [ Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Sa-tevo wrote:
Rover wrote:
Come on! You know that every gun previous to the EVO10 is useless trash to be peddled to unknowing newbies. Sip that Kool-Ade!


Don't you have some clouds that you should be yelling at?


Damn right! They keep taking on these filthy pornographic shapes; and in front of the children, too.

Author:  SlartyBartFast [ Wed Jan 11, 2017 9:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Just an observation from a noob:

Granted, testing might find the best pellets for your gun. But why go to the trouble and expense? Shoot 10 out of a tin, measure the group, and if it's good, it's good.

Use the time and money you save to buy a training system.

When the training system says all your shots are in the 10 ring, but your pellets aren't, THEN look for the "perfect pellets".

Author:  Ed333 [ Sun Feb 05, 2017 4:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Noob question on condition of pellets, out of a sleeve of Vogels, I have one 500 count container where all of the pellets have oxidized (?), a light gray powdery coating on all of them. All of the other containers had bright shiny pellets. My inclination is to not use them, thinking they would crud up my bore, plus contaminate the floor in front of the firing point, plus the handling. Am I thinking correctly?

Author:  rmca [ Sun Feb 05, 2017 5:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

SlartyBartFast wrote:
Just an observation from a noob:
Granted, testing might find the best pellets for your gun. But why go to the trouble and expense? Shoot 10 out of a tin, measure the group, and if it's good, it's good.
Use the time and money you save to buy a training system.
When the training system says all your shots are in the 10 ring, but your pellets aren't, THEN look for the "perfect pellets".

SlartyBartFast

Your shots will never be all in the ten ring in AP, and if you read the first post, you will see that this is primarily for peace of mind and confidence in one's equipment.

The current training systems suitable for Olympic disciplines that I know off, are all terribly expensive, and are no substitute for pellet testing.
With a human hold, be it as good as it can be, will never suffice to determine the difference between two brands of "decent" pellets.
Look at the test, and you'll see the difference is measured in millimetres, and only a couple of millimeters. No human can do that...

Training systems like scatt or others, are desinged to help you analyze the various stages that comprise a shot, not just "hold" dimensions.
And if you look at elite shooter scatt's files, you'll see that their hold is not always within the ten ring.

So, although some my think it's a waste of time, to me it helps a lot. IT brings peace of mind in a match, knowing that my equipment is performing as it should be.
Can't blame the pistol that way... ;)

Same is true for .22lr

Best Regards

Author:  rmca [ Sun Feb 05, 2017 6:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Ed333 wrote:
Noob question on condition of pellets, out of a sleeve of Vogels, I have one 500 count container where all of the pellets have oxidized (?), a light gray powdery coating on all of them. All of the other containers had bright shiny pellets. My inclination is to not use them, thinking they would crud up my bore, plus contaminate the floor in front of the firing point, plus the handling. Am I thinking correctly?

It won't hurt your gun, and unless you are not holding them in your mouth, and washing your hands after, they will be OK.

That said, I would not fire them in my gun and would probably ended up melting them... ;)

Hope this helps

Author:  Rover [ Sun Feb 05, 2017 8:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

Aah, just shoot the damned things.

Author:  Ricardo [ Sun Feb 05, 2017 10:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Pellet Testing... AGAIN!

I'm a biochemist, and I say this so you have some idea that this is not an urban myth: Lead oxide is fairly toxic, more so than lead metal. It's the lead ions that go do nasty things to your nerve cells and your kidneys. I would get rid of them. In the lab this is considered hazardous material.

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