TargetTalk

In this world where a 2001 vintage computer is considered "old" and we tend to write off yesterday's technology as obsolete, I am becoming more and more interested in giving an "old dog" another day in the sun. Particularly the FWB 65MkII, RWS Model 10 or 6M or similar venerable design. Don Nygord's recent passing got me thinking about the world class scores he every other top international competitor shot with a 65MkII, and the fact that these are still every bit as valid on the line as their scions of the CA and CO2 variety. I have always owned at least one "cocker" and I am considering competing this winter with one, both as a challenge to myself and the pistols themselves. Actually, it is no challenge to the pistol. A well-tuned 65 or 6M will outperform the capabilities of any shooter, regardless of what they choose to compete with for ease of use.

So, post a response with who you are, what you use, your highest score using it and anything else relating to the type.

As for my "old-timer" experience:
Pistol: AirMatch 600, circa 1989
High Competition Score: 547
High Practice Score: 556
Why I stopped using it in competition: Bought a Pardini K2

Heck, I shot my first two seasons with a Daisy 717 and took first expert at a match with it over shooters with Steyrs and the like.

I'll answer for my coach:

Pistol: Feinwerkbau mod. 65 (one of the first wave)
High Competition Score: 390 (AP40) / 564 (AP60)*
High Practice Score: ~
Why I stopped using it in competition: still in using


* - sometimes pistol has "maked" unnoticed by shooter 7, 6... problem was in backoff system.

I shoot an IZH 46m. In my 3rd match I scored my best of 540. I am shooting very well now. I have had a serious break through and I cannot wait for my next match. Look out China.(grin)

* - sometimes pistol has "maked" unnoticed by shooter 7, 6... problem was in backoff system.


what do you mean by this statement ?
thanks

Pistol: Feinwerkbau 65 (used from 1992-1996)
High Competition Score: 538/600
Why I stopped using it: High School owned it and I moved away. Now I've got a Steyr LP-1P.

I used a FWB M65 from about 67 to mid 70s, when the first good match CO2 guns appeared. My club still owns a vintage M65, and I use it occasionally, just to measure my skill (or lack of same).

I used an old FWB CO2-2 from about 1982 to 1997.
Best competition score with that gun: AP 60: 578
Training: about the same.
Sold it because there was noticeable shift of point of impact "during a cylinder". Trigger pull inferior to that of Morinis.

I now use Morini M162 M.
Best competition score: 571
Training score: 575.

The reason for the decreasing scores are my increasing age, and poorer eye sight, I recon.

Hey Patrick - you're so right. Its very easy to get conned into the "if it ain't the latest, its inferior" way of thinking. This is how the car industry thrives. I drive a really old car, but it works fine, and does all I require it to. Likewise, my air pistol is an oldie but a goodie, and until I can shoot 570s with it, I see no justification for changing!

Pistol: FWB 80
Highest comp score: 530/600
Highest pract score: 537/600
Why I stopped using it: I haven't!!

George Merriman

Hey Kiwi, nice to hear from the other side of the planet!

It is so true regarding the perceived obsolescence of all manner of things. Let's all take this little quiz for a moment:

Would you rather own:

a) A 1957 Stratocaster or a 2004 Ibanez?
b) A 1964 Shelby Cobra or a 2004 Ford Mustang?
c) A 1970 Rolex Datejust or a 2004 Timex?

It all gets down to the disposable society and fashion as opposed to function. Could Roberto DiDonna or Yifu Wang pick up a 1975 vintage FWB 65 and far outshoot you, even though you are shooting with a top-end Paranormal Industries 3000 air pistol with custom grips and tri-beam mounted, knurled counter weights? You bet yer ass they could.

So, new stuff is great. But don't ever let someone go off about how something "old" is no good, simply based on the fact that is is old. I hate that mentality.

My first was a second-hand FWB 65 in 1978, just starting AP - best in comp was 537. Sold it, got a FWB CO2-2, worked up to 556 best in comp. Sold that, got a Walther CP3, have topped 560 a few times in club-level matches.
Still have the CP3, still shoot it, but missed some of the other stuff. Have acquired an FWB 90, Diana Mod. 10, FWB CO2-2(again) Crosman-Skanakar and Walther LP3 Match (compression lever ahead of grip).
How do they/I shoot?
I'm a bit out of practice, but still hit the high 540s with the Walther CP3. Playing with the others, I'll shoot 540 with the FWB 90, Skanakar and Diana 10, a bit better than that with the FWB CO2-2 and about 525 with the Walther LP3.
Technology does march on, and I'd like to try one of ther state-of-the-art CA guns -- but I'll keep these old crocks just for the enjoyment of their build and mechanical complexity.

Although I have owned a Morini short with the electronic trigger for close to 12 months now, I still haven't managed to top the scores I was getting with my old FWB Model 80.
I still have the Model 80, although I have now put it up for sale. I will miss it when it goes.
With the FWB-80 I had a top of 556 and was regularly dipping into the 550s. Since purchasing the Morini, I now shoot low to mid 540s and only twice have made it to 550.
My advise is to anyone starting out is to buy an old "cranker". They still shoot better than most of us and unlike the Co2 pistols do not develop bad habits in changing temperatures. They are also fairly cheap to have a new main spring and seals fitted.

I was just about to present an answer but my wife wants me to rub some cream on the heels of her feet!

Tom

Started in 1981 with the fwb m65
I quit in 1983
I can't really recall my best scores but in training I got close to 370/400
In competition I think I did something like 337/400
I was 13 years old
The pistol belong to the club so I could not hang on to it
33 years later I use a
FWB M65!
Great pistol
Right now my best score in training is 568/600

Depends on how old is "old". The Morini 162EI design is well over 20 years old, and is still winning medals at top level competitions.

Does anyone know if a current very top shooter has ever been asked to shoot an old FWB 65 to see what they could do with it?

Any shooter capable of shooting 580 or better is considered “world-class”. Top shooters of the past were capable of achieving 580-590’s with their FWB 65’s. I believe current top shooters should be able to achieve similar scores, or maybe not, remember how long it took to break Sergei Pyzhianov’s world record...

Did no one notice that this thread is dated 2005?

No matter, I agree, but am rooting for the better SSPs.

I admit that my best ever score of 576 was shot with an FWB90. I also admit I was under the influence of a "medicinal herb" and shooting 2/3 matches a day in practice.

Rover wrote:Did no one notice that this thread is dated 2005?

Ae you saying vintage threads are not as good as modern ones?

Crosman Skanaker,FWB 65,80,90,C55 repater,102. Luv em all.

TenMetrePeter wrote:

Rover wrote:Did no one notice that this thread is dated 2005?

Ae you saying vintage threads are not as good as modern ones?

Only that they are probably far more realistic than the "web-babble" posted lately.

Used my FWB CO2-2 in competitions in the 80s. It`s still in use for practice, occasionally.
High score in competition: 385 (AP40)/ 576 (AP60).
Some new O-rings, and some other parts have been replaced. Several 10,000s of pellets fired from this gun during the decades.