10m AR Equipment vs Performance

[TS]

Hi shooters,

Would just like to ask how much will equipment limit our performance? I'm currently using slightly large jacket and pants with a pair of boots, but without shooting glasses (i'm nearsighted), shooting inner or a rifle stand.

Was wondering what kind of scores are achievable with less-than-ideal equipment?

Thanks!

[Hemmers]

Well, I started 3P last October. Outdoors, I was getting 930s in 3x40 matches after a winter of shooting an indoor postal. This was with club jacket, club rifle, etc - all club kit except my glove. Rifle also had a rubber butt-plate, not a hooked plate, which is not ideal for standing.

Anyway, over Easter I got a new jacket custom-fitted, which is far better than the ill-fitting club jacket I was using. My standing has jumped fom a 213 average to a 250 average, and my new PB is 269 after I got a pair of second-hand boots. I don't have any trousers, so I couldn't say whether I favour soft or stiff. My kneeling is also consistently better since I got the boots. My prone is not great though, since my position has suffered with the new, stiff jacket and I'm still getting set up properly for prone, but my scores are getting better again.

Decide whether your outdoor summer, or indoor winter postal comps are more important to you, and use that to base when you get a new jacket - which set of scores do you want to trash while you're still adjusting new equipment!? I consider my outdoor more important, but I knew I needed a new jacket that fitted properly, so I bit the bullet and got it at Easter.

In short, I believe a good Jacket is a must for 3P - I've found it very much more comfortable for standing. Boots can be second-hand - As long as they're about the right size, you can tighten down the laces and any ankle straps. That's crucially just a flat base with some ankle support to stand on which stops you rocking on the balls or heels of our feet, so as long as they're not majorly loose they should be OK. My new rifle (Ansch. 1913 Supermatch in Walnut stock) arrives in a couple of weeks.

That said, it's kind of hard to gauge the impact to scores, since I know mentally my approach to 3P has changed, especially since the outdoor season started. I used to rattle off 40 shots standing in about 1/2 an hour. I've slowed down to use more of the time available, especially since I now have a stand, so I can rest and reload without having to break position to lay down the rifle or pick up rounds from a table in front of me, so that's going to be partially responsible for my improvement.

Will let you know how own rifle +butt-hook +ability to fettle it for myself and noone else affects my scores. I think the hook is going to make the major difference to my scores in all 3 positions.

[TS]

Hi Hemmers,

Thanks a lot for your reply.

Been considering getting a better fitting suit for some time now, but wanted to see if i can reach a certain standard before actually spending the money. I always thought if i wasn't getting good scores, not much point getting new and improved gear anyway.

But lately have been wondering if i was sort of wasting my time training without all the standard gear top shooters use...

Btw i think you should get a pair of shooting pants..helps quite a bit in standing, also helps prevent injury to your back/spine if i'm not mistaken

[KDS USA]

Why is everyone else so good compared to me? Lol.

[peepsight]

Hi KDS

Just like there are shooters better than you, there are also shooters not as good as you. Keep it in perspective.

[Pat McCoy]

TS

Congratulations on your gains in average.

We often have our junior shooters use rifle only (normal street shoes, jeans, and tshirts) and see 3 to 5 point drops (per 10 shot target). Our best shooters drop from 97-98 to 93-96, while less experienced shooters drop from 83-85 to 78-80.

Your inner position and mental processes are more important that the equipment, however tht boots, jacket, and shooting pants help you maintain good form for longer periods of time.

Remember, this is an athletic sport, and we are supposed to be athletes. Your coach should be able to help you find positions that are not detrimental to your body, and offer ideas for physical training to strengthen the parts of your body which take to most stress.

[Joe66]

You must wear shooting glasses. It is important to have the jacket fit right for you, pants is not as important, OK to be a little loose.

[WaltherWill]

One thing that will help your scores a ton is the shooting stand. This is practically neccesary for all precision shooters. I don't know what kind of rifle you shoot but I assume it weighs more than about 8 pounds. The ability to rest that gun while loading, or just regrouping and resting your self, is so important to stamina and long-term muscle stability. It almost pains me to think about the shooters in my club who shoot pump-up sporters and don't use a stand and how hard they must be working to shoot at all past, ohh, 15 shots. In this day, Internationally competing precision shooters shoot 60 shots for record in one string in the same position at the same target every time not to mention the almost 20 sighters. Holding the rifle for almost 2 hours with no resting place between shots is torture.
You don't have to get a really expensive one or anything and if you don't have one, almost anything to rest the gun on would be SOO beneficial

[TS]

Thanks for the replies guys

Your inner position and mental processes are more important that the equipment, however tht boots, jacket, and shooting pants help you maintain good form for longer periods of time.

I too believe that fundamentals are the most important, thus i'm reluctant to upgrade to top-of-the-line gear. However, I just wanted to know how much improvement can be achieved solely by getting custom jackets and pants, a shooting stand, shooting sweater and shooting glasses.

Or to put it another way, is there a score limitation if i shoot without all the gear mentioned above?

[mikeschroeder]

Hi Hemmers,

Thanks a lot for your reply.

Been considering getting a better fitting suit for some time now, but wanted to see if i can reach a certain standard before actually spending the money. I always thought if i wasn't getting good scores, not much point getting new and improved gear anyway...

Hi

I believe that the use of a standard score to buy more equipment is generally a bad idea. The decision shouldn't rest on your ability, on your scores, or on any outside ideas. If you believe that spending the money will make you happy over an extended period, the spend it. Or Don't. The balance is whether or not you will still be using your jacket in a year. You could get bored, burned out etc.

I try and mention this to the kids joining the shooting team. For one thing, it's pretty easy to sell a second hand 888, but the mats, kneeling rolls, and stands are a tough sell. Spotting scopes are also easy to sell.

Mike
Wichita KS

[Hemmers]

You must wear shooting glasses. It is important to have the jacket fit right for you, pants is not as important, OK to be a little loose.

I don't have to worry with that faf fortunately (a lot of colleagues either have to set up glasses or wear contacts to shoot). I'm blessed with 20-20 vision. No doubt one day my eyesight will deteriorate, but I'm enjoying not needing expensive glasses or contacts for the time being :).

One thing that will help your scores a ton is the shooting stand. This is practically neccesary for all precision shooters.

Yeah. At our club (indoors) we have a ledge at about the right height, and a stand isn't so important for 10-shot cards anyway. I did maybe 3 outdoor 3x40 matches before I bought a stand. Made life so much easier. All that was available if you didn't have a stand were tables at about waist height, so you had to break position to reach down for the next round. The stand lets me both reload and take breaks without having to move my feet, unshoulder the rifle or even bend over.

Why is everyone else so good compared to me? Lol.

It'll come. Keep plugging away.[/img]