753 vs 853

FastBoneDoc · Post by **FastBoneDoc** » Fri Mar 04, 2005 10:56 am

Well, my boys went to their second league session. They were issued some crappy old bb/pellet guns that barely propelled the pellets to the targets (onepellet bounced back to us, barely deformed). Needless to say their shots were all over the place. Luckily it did not dim their enthusiasm

I'd rather not go CO2 for now since I want them to practice at home when they have time.

Is the 853 accurate enough to train my youngsters? Our club has a few Tau juniors, but they are a bit too heavy for my 9 and 11 yr olds.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Mar 04, 2005 11:25 am

In a vice, our 853's will shoot somewhat jagged one hole groups with every match pellet we've tried. Problems is that the 9-11 year olds can't charge them. We have gone to the 888 CO2 gun which is just as accurate but doesn't require the cocking force needed for the 853. The CO2 cylinders get 200-300 shots per filling and can be refilled from a bulk tank or any place that fills paint ball guns. We have spares so that we always have cylinders available. We don't have to refill at practice. 200 shots will keep a kid practicing at home pretty busy but if it's not enough keep a spare full cylinder.

Sam

Pat McCoy · Post by **Pat McCoy** » Fri Mar 04, 2005 11:26 am

Yes, it is very accuarate. Only problem you need to watch is being sure the positions are rebuilt properly after cocking.

FastBoneDoc · Post by **FastBoneDoc** » Fri Mar 04, 2005 11:44 am

Besides the stock, what makes a 753 so much more expensive? Is the trigger the same as the 853's?
Can the 853 be brought up to 753 specs with aftermarket parts?

Pat McCoy · Post by **Pat McCoy** » Fri Mar 04, 2005 3:49 pm

Stock and rear sight on 753 are better than 853. Triggers are the same, and there is a good explaination of how to modify the trigger on Pilkguns.com.

X Man · Post by **X Man** » Fri Mar 04, 2005 11:13 pm

Accuracy is great with the 753/853, but cocking it requires quite a bit of strength. My son is now 18, I wish I had gone ahead, way back then and purchased an air charged rifle like the XS40. This is the rifle you need to go ahead and get. Your kids can use this rifle all the way until they are 20 years old, in the NRA Sectionals. You will be better off in the long run, to spend the money now.

TWP · Post by **TWP** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 8:51 am

I bought an 853 for my daughter, She couldn't cock it, ended up trading it for an 888 which she used for a few months before we got her a FWB P70 Jr., she used that for about a year and wanted a heavier gun, ended up getting her an Anschutz 2002CA. She's very happy with it.

Personally If your boys have any desire to go beyond sporter and shoot precision I wouldn't bother with the 753, I'd get them an 888, then move up to a precision gun when they are ready.

Jay V · Post by **Jay V** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 10:47 am

TWP wrote:(SNIP) Personally If your boys have any desire to go beyond sporter and shoot precision I wouldn't bother with the 753, I'd get them an 888, then move up to a precision gun when they are ready.

I'll second that.

The 753s/853s are good guns, but cocking the gun presents some problems - breaking position for one, the extra effort (smaller kids really struggle) for another. It can take a lot of the fun out of shooting just wrestling with the rifle.

I like the 888. It's inexpensive, tough, and accurate. The XS-40 Valiant is good, but it's twice the price. We have more Valiants than 888s, and the Valiant has a (somewhat) better stock design and is precharged-air powered, but the 888 is still the choice of almost all of the top 3P sporter shooters nationally.

CO2 isn't that bad, and the 888 holds a lot. You will need some type of CO2 tank though. We have a 20# tank, but 5-10# would be fine for a few guns.

Jay V
AIAC
IL
www.aiac-airguns.org

FastBoneDoc · Post by **FastBoneDoc** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 2:20 pm

Is there any built-in indicator as to when the CO2 is almost empty?
Is this prevented by "topping off" the gun every time?

Finally, is it customary to leave CO2 in the gun during storage, or does one have to empty it to preserve the seals?

Thanks. Now the question is, do I buy 2 or 1...

TWP · Post by **TWP** » Sun Mar 06, 2005 9:43 am

There is no "Gauge" on the 888's to show the level of CO2.

For practice we keep several spare cylinders full, go by the sound of the shots to tell when they are getting low. For matches all guns get topped up before the match.

They are stored with the CO2 tanks full and on the rifle.

jhmartin · Post by **jhmartin** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 8:24 am

I'm in my 1st season with AR ... I'm coaching kids from 9yrs old to 18 here in NM.

The 853/753/888 and VS40 all use the same barrel.

Jay V strongly suggested the 888's for us. I went to a local hight school JROTC and borrowed a variety of rifles ... an 853, a Crosman 2000, and then took a shooter in to shoot a 753 and an 888 as well as the XS40. There is no way a smaller kid can stay in position and cock the 853 or 753.

888 was a winner hands down for price and accuracy. The coaches here in Valencia county just purchased 8 of these rifles and the kids love to shoot them. CO2 is not a problem ... we purchased(well leased) 20 lb tanks (for 25 yrs or such) and that only cost about $100/tank ... when we fill a 20 lb tank it's only about $12.

I don't get too analytical about getting a full 2.5 oz charge in the cylinders ... If I get 2 oz in it, we'll still get over 150 shots per charge .... I end up dumping most of the cylinders at the end of practice anyway.
(I learned not to do a full charge at home in a cold garage, and then toss the cylinders in the passenger side floor area for a trip to the range .... popped a burst disk ... makes an exciting time ... :-) ) Luckily the 888 cylinders use the same 3K burst disk that Walmart carries.

The 888 also has a MUCH nicer sling rail that the 753/853 cockers. The 888's come with the Daisy sights standard, but you can upgrade to to the Gamo sights for about $70-100 I think. It was suggested to hold off on the Gamo's until the kids shoot higher scores

The ONLY downside I've bumped into is that these rifles have a heavy trigger pull (about 4.5 lbs). We've started lowering this on a few rifles for our Senior 4-H shooters ... but this is a common issue on all the 853/753/888 type actions.

The short story ... for the extra $25 or so per rifle over the 853, you can't go wrong on the 888's.

Denise Johnson at Daisy is a great person to help you.

Joel Martin
Valencia County, NM
4-H AR Coach

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 11:12 am

Weigh the 888 cylinders empty with an inexpensive postal scale and write it on the cylinder. If there is a question as to how much CO2 is left just weigh it and see.

We fill from a bulk tank and I would recommend weighing the freshly filled tank. Check the weight periodically and you'll know how much CO2 is left. You will need a bigger scale than a small postal scale. You don't want to be getting ready for a match and run out of CO2.

Sam

jhmartin · Post by **jhmartin** » Wed Mar 09, 2005 8:01 am

Yes ... I do weigh the cylinders.

It was "D.A." thing to do ... I put 2.7oz in a 2.5oz cylinder and took them for a 20 minute ride in a warm truck .... thought my heater had popped a hose for about 2 sec .... then the sutpidity dawned on me.

No problem when I follow the mfgr's directions now though.......

Joel M