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A forum to talk about Olympic style shooting, rifle or pistol, 10 meters to 50 meters, and whatever is in between. Hosted by Pilkguns.com
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 Post subject: Drive U nutz pellet test
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2017 3:49 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:20 pm
Posts: 4848
Location: Scottsdale AZ
Here's the deal: There were a few tins of pellets floating around the range so I grabbed them.

I was prepared to give you group sizes, but some were so close it seemed pointless. I shot 30 shot groups out of a vise. All groups would fit inside the ten ring and hit the 11 ring.
I shot these groups with my Steyr LP1, refilling the cylinder after each 90 shots. I didn't chronograph anything.

Here are the pellets:
Crosman Super Match 7.9 grains
Qiang Yuan Olympic (their top of the line) 8.3 grains, 4.49 diameter
H&N Finale Match Rifle 7.97 grains 4.51 diameter
H&N Finale Match Pistol 8.1 grains, 4.50 diameter (older lot, note the weight)
RWS Diabalo Basic 7 grains, three different lots

Crosman was the largest group, but it still fit in the 10ring
Qiang Yuan were next, but a noticeably smaller group of about .233 (group size minus pellet diameter)
Finale Match Rifle, .188" group, round & pretty
Finale Match Pistol, .178" group, but not so round (note...heavier than rifle pellet)
RWS Basic Lot 1, .288"
RWS Basic Lot 2, .218
RWS Basic Lot 3, .171 (This was the last tin of a lot I was using in my Walther LPM1. Wish I had more, but I'll be using Lot 2 and the remainder of the Finale Match Pistol from now on.)

I weighed all the pellets in lots of 10 on my reloading scale, then divided by 10. The surprise here was that the H&N Pistol were heavier than the Rifle. I remember a statement by an H&N staffer that they tested pellets and the best ones went into Rifle tins and others into Pistol regardless of weight. ???

Make of this what you will....just don't ask me what the best pellet is. (But I'm going with the cheapies.)


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2017 4:46 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 12:31 pm
Posts: 796
Location: New Hampshire, USA
Fake news! Rigged numbers!

Rover loves RWS Basic pellets. Rover tests several kinds of pellets. RWS Basic deliver best groups. Is anybody suspicious? Is there an endorsement deal in the works?


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2017 6:05 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 8:50 pm
Posts: 53
Location: San Antonio, TX
I don't understand why pellet price is a significant factor when even the most expensive pellets are cheaper per tin than the average lunch. Not to mention what their cost is in comparison with cartridge ammunition. A person will drop $2k for an AP but has problems spending less than 1% of its value for 500 rounds to feed it.

My only wish is that the better stuff or at least a good variety of pellets were carried locally. The only pellets carried here worth mentioning are Crossman and RWS. I prefer the RWS. The crossman are dirtier. They may coated with a grease and they also have mold marks. They make my fingers black. Price for me is less of a factor compared with accuracy, availability, and quality.

Just my thoughts.

Dave


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2017 7:21 pm 
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Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Posts: 355
A rifle shooter would throw all those lots away! Might throw the barrel away!!


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2017 7:28 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:20 pm
Posts: 4848
Location: Scottsdale AZ
Price is a factor when you get three or more tins of pellets for the same price with little or no decrease in performance. But then, perhaps your skill level is so high that a few thousandth of an inch is the difference between success and failure. If you're buying your pellets at Wally World, you have problems anyway.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2017 8:28 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 28, 2015 4:40 pm
Posts: 252
pfffft I mold my own pellets...


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2017 9:52 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 8:50 pm
Posts: 53
Location: San Antonio, TX
What I am trying to say is that it is worth spending a few extra dollars for better pellets and that the price differences between garbage pellets and great pellets are insignificant compared to the cost of your investment. They may be much more expensive than garbage pellets percentage wise, but when compared to the cost of a new 10M AP it is insignificant. Spend the extra money on good pellets and only have a single patty burger rather than a double one day a week. Don't worry about an extra $5.00 for a good tin of pellets. You can save some money by buying them a sleeve at a time.

I am not so good that 1/10th of a point here and there will make much difference between the several brands of good pellets. When I start shooting 580s and 590s I might start worrying about it.

Currently, I will continue to shoot my Nygord "World Champion" pellets, which I believe to be H&N, untill they are exhausted. And I will also shoot RWS meisterkugeln professional line, which I can source locally.

73's

Dave


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:41 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 28, 2015 4:40 pm
Posts: 252
Well,

if you shoot twice a week for a year, you can save $200-300 a year by using the Basic instead of Meisterkugel.

I tend to use more expensive pellets (JSB Match and Meisterkugel pretty much) though, I don't shoot as much as I used to, so the savings aren't great.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 1:22 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:20 pm
Posts: 4848
Location: Scottsdale AZ
To make this all the more confusing....

It doesn't make ANY difference WHAT brand you're shooting, it is ONLY a particular lot number of any selected batch of pellets that will "bring home the bacon."

Here's another thread that was just down the page:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=54059


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:49 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2015 7:25 pm
Posts: 22
Quote:
Well,

if you shoot twice a week for a year, you can save $200-300 a year by using the Basic instead of Meisterkugel.


I found a difference of $30 between basis ($42/5000) and MK ($72/5000) Champion Shooters Supply

So a $300/yr difference would equate to 10*5000, or 50,000 pellets.

If your shooting twice a week, that's almost 500 shots per session.

Just poking you a little, I get great results with basics, including my 2nd highest score ever (568).

My only complaint is they tend to leave my fingers a lot dirtier that either MK or R10s.

Oh, and my old plastic pellet keeper doesn't fit the tin (doesn't fit MK either)


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:09 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 28, 2015 4:40 pm
Posts: 252
basics cost 2.30 Euros per one tin (500)
meisterkugel, JSB, cost 7 Euros per tin

Let's say 1 tin is good for 4 sessions, 2 sessions per week, that's 2 weeks.

So, that's 26 tins per year, that's 13,000 shots, for some people that's not much.

The saving here are 26*(7-2.30)=122 Euros.

That's indeed less than I wrote, but there are people who have a home range and they probably shoot way more than I do.

Most folks though have training pellets and competition pellets, for no other reason than money. I see some people training with match box pellets... they're super expensive, something like 20 Euros per 500 shots.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 11:39 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2015 7:25 pm
Posts: 22
I've never found basics that cheap; that would sure change the numbers.

But really, I was just yanking your chain.

Full disclosure - I usually put the MKs I'm shooting in an R10 tin (so my pellet keeper works).
I'm sure most folks assume I'm shooting R10s in training.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 6:44 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:20 pm
Posts: 4848
Location: Scottsdale AZ
I can get a sleeve of Basics del'd for $50 (penny a pellet). I take the lid off the Basics and put it on the bottom of a R10 tin. That way everyone knows they're being beaten by some of the cheapest pellets out there and they fit the pellet keeper.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 10:01 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2014 4:36 pm
Posts: 159
Location: Bury, Lancashire, England.
Does anyone know where I can buy Basics from in the UK? I've searched, but without success.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 12:06 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 28, 2015 4:40 pm
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try Germany,

I bought a lot of other stuff from UK (books, clothes, alarm clock), I don't see why somebody wouldn't send pellets.

This would be the cheapest, but I don't know if they send to UK

This would be another option, but you have to ask for shipping cost yourself.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 3:02 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2014 4:36 pm
Posts: 159
Location: Bury, Lancashire, England.
hundert wrote:
try Germany,

I bought a lot of other stuff from UK (books, clothes, alarm clock), I don't see why somebody wouldn't send pellets.

This would be the cheapest, but I don't know if they send to UK

This would be another option, but you have to ask for shipping cost yourself.
Thank you for your help. I've only just seen your reply. I did buy a sleeve from Buinger yesterday, which came to £41.68 including shipping, which is a few pounds cheaper than the Geco's that I was buying.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 4:57 am 
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Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 9:22 am
Posts: 154
Location: North of England
I bought 20 tins from this seller:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Diabolo-fur-L ... F6EEi6_xBQ

Came to about £60.00

There were only 17 tins in the package,delivered by Hermes. The seller insisted 20 were sent, but compensated me for the missing 3 tins.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:00 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:51 pm
Posts: 10
Location: Luxembourg
I also buy my pellets from Germany.
Holme in particular (https://holme-onlineshop.de) and I am very satisfied with their service. I highly recommend them.
It takes some google translate perhaps if you don't speak german, but it s very much worth the hassle, especially if you buy in bulk!

19€ flat shipping rate to Luxembourg... regardless of weight or number of packs.
I am sure they also deliver to the UK, you have to check/ask.

Cherry on the cake, they don't charge me the german VAT% either!
So when I am logged in, and given my delivery address (LU); I see lower prices compared to the ones advertised if you browse anonymously.

These are the direct links for RWS Basics in case you are interested:
3 tins pack or 1,500 pellets: https://holme-onlineshop.de/luftdruck-m ... 1-500.html
10 tins pack or 5,000 pellets: https://holme-onlineshop.de/luftdruck-m ... 5-000.html
50 tins pack or 25,000 pellets: https://holme-onlineshop.de/luftdruck-m ... 5-000.html
100 tins pack or 50,000 pellets: https://holme-onlineshop.de/luftdruck-m ... 0-000.html

This is not intended as an advertisement but I am a really happy customer buying from those guys :)

Cheers
Fadi

PS: They also sell their own brand of pellets, which is a partnership with RWS itself. I've never tried them personally, but might be worth a check.

_________________
When you want something you've never had, you have to do something you've never done.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 12:42 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:20 pm
Posts: 4848
Location: Scottsdale AZ
OMG I cannot believe how cheap the Basics are from this company!!!

Since their house "RWS" pellets are just rebranded, I wonder what they really are.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 1:43 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:51 pm
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Location: Luxembourg
Rover wrote:
OMG I cannot believe how cheap the Basics are from this company!!!

Since their house "RWS" pellets are just rebranded, I wonder what they really are.


They offer three different pellets, all are RWS rebranded... but they are not always available to order.
Sometimes you have to wait a few weeks, and can't have all the quantities you want.

1. Holme Super Standard which is a selection from RWS Sport Line
2. Holme Match which is a selection from RWS Professional Line
3. Holme Match Premium which is a selection from RWS Premium Line

I have the impression that they sell what they get (and when they get it) from RWS.
It seems more like a liquidation channel for RWS on their excess production or something of this kind.
Not sure though on that part... just speculation :-)

Either case, Holme rocks for buying pellets in bulk.
Can't beat them!

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When you want something you've never had, you have to do something you've never done.


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