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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 6:21 am 
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hi All -
During training, I generally perform holding exercises for 40-45mins (25sec on, 30 sec off..5holds then rest 1 minute etc ). Once the exercises are done, dry firing and live firing starts. There is barely a 5-10 min gap between holding and dry/live. So my hand is very steady in training and I shoot better
However, in a match scenario, the gap is higher between holding and dry/live - sometimes 30mins-45mins, assuming that organisers have identified a place for holding/dry. If long distance travel is involved, matters get worse. The organisers provide some 15mins for preparations that can be utilised for holding/dry, but that just is not enough to make my hand steady. This results in poor initial shooting and I am just playing catchup in later series. For a long time, I thought it was match pressure - but if I use the same gaps in training, the scores are similar (suck)
Is there anything that can be done to stabilize the hand in such scenarios. Does it get better with time or more holding? Desperately need a solution as I have a series of matches lined up from next month.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 7:15 am 
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How about a stall in the Men's Room.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 7:44 am 
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From everything I have run across, activities that could tire your muscles are counterproductive right before a match. It is recommended that any strength training be discontinued several days before a big match.

I suspect the benefit you are experiencing is more from the warming up and stretching that occurs from the holding than the holding itself, in which case developing stretches that work on those muscles could be all you need.

As an example, I have problems with muscle spasms in my arm, and find that stretching the muscles on top of my forearm before shooting helps. All I need to do is straighten out my arm, cock my hand down, and apply a downward force on my hand. The weight of a pistol will work, but I can also use my other arm, or the back of the bench top.

I think I've seen recommended stretching exercises for pistol shooting, but they tend to be fairly generic. I don't recall seeing any that are particular to the lifting & holding muscles. Maybe someone else can provide a link.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 8:55 am 
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this makes sense. Let me try warming the muscles by stretching and try for few sessions. Will post the results.

Gwhite wrote:
From everything I have run across, activities that could tire your muscles are counterproductive right before a match. It is recommended that any strength training be discontinued several days before a big match.

I suspect the benefit you are experiencing is more from the warming up and stretching that occurs from the holding than the holding itself, in which case developing stretches that work on those muscles could be all you need.

As an example, I have problems with muscle spasms in my arm, and find that stretching the muscles on top of my forearm before shooting helps. All I need to do is straighten out my arm, cock my hand down, and apply a downward force on my hand. The weight of a pistol will work, but I can also use my other arm, or the back of the bench top.

I think I've seen recommended stretching exercises for pistol shooting, but they tend to be fairly generic. I don't recall seeing any that are particular to the lifting & holding muscles. Maybe someone else can provide a link.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 9:20 am 
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I am in the same boat as you are, warm ups don't help, one hour of shooting does, after that the scores are very good. This is a consistent observation over hundreds of sessions. In January I've finished two sessions with a 99 in AP in the last series. So I start off every session shooting something slightly above 90s, and then after around an hour, I start shooting 95+ per series. In competition, I don't have that hour, that's why I end up shooting something like 370... sometimes even less. It has nothing to do with match pressure, because in a match the last series is where I start shooting well, after about the same time interval as in training.

I've never shot well right at the start of a training.

Maybe it has something to do with blood sugar, maybe something else, like one muscle type getting tired and the other being activated instead, I don't know... but as I said, it never happened not even once that I come in and shoot scores that I shoot at the end of sessions.

I actually find it unacceptable that pretty much in every other sports people get to warm up for hours if they wish to.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 4:19 pm 
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Location: White Sulphur Springs, MT, USA
Quote:
During training, I generally perform holding exercises for 40-45mins (25sec on, 30 sec off..5holds then rest 1 minute etc ). Once the exercises are done, dry firing and live firing starts.


You may want to try doing the dry hold training on a different day than the dry fire and live fire training. You may be teaching your unconscious that you must have a long dry hold period before actual shooting. A new method may be to dry hold one day, they the next day go immediately to a few dry fire shots and then a live shot. Eventually try picking up the gun and shooting live shots without dry firing, then walk away and return for another shot. Much like "up/downs" are used bby position rifle shooters.

Quote:
warm ups don't help, one hour of shooting does,


Perhaps also a mental set problem. Once the lower scoring strings are fired your mind allows you to relax and "just shoot" without concern for the outcome?


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 5:15 pm 
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Location: Scottsdale AZ
They say shooting is a "mental game."

Are you "mental."


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 8:50 pm 
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it's a 100% physical. bad series, especially in training are not affecting me emotionally one bit.

When I point the gun down range I can see my holding area (sorta like imagining seeing my scatt line) and I already know where the average shots are going to land, at the end of the training it always feels like I'm holding the 10 ring, no movement at all, but the first 50-60 minutes it's much larger than 10, and on a bad day it even goes over to the 7.

so, if you solve the problem, that'd be great :) I think it's something like blood sugar... maybe something with atp or lactic acid .... IDK


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 29, 2017 12:53 pm 
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Location: Aotearoa/NZ
Most match directors should provide space on a separate range for holding exercises.

Any holding should just be to wake up the muscles, so nothing crazy. I wouldn't stretch, personally. I don't think you should be exerting any force that you wouldn't do in your match.
Getting tired during your match should not be a thing -- if it is then physiological conditioning should be your focus. Imho, you should be able to shoot for 1:45 with no bother.

As for long distance travel:
Arrive two days before hand if you are serious about doing well.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 30, 2017 4:35 am 
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Location: Costa Rica, Central America
ForceAwakens wrote:
Desperately need a solution as I have a series of matches lined up from next month.

That’s a tell tale sign that the “force” is not with you.

Rover wrote:
They say shooting is a "mental game."

I concur with Rover, it’s a mental issue. Here’s an interesting read:

https://www.ssusa.org/articles/2015/8/5 ... 90-mental/


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 9:28 pm 
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Need to continue my training even if things don't turn around quickly. As Yoda said "“If you end your training now — if you choose the quick and easy path as Vader did — you will become an agent of evil.”

kevinweiho wrote:
ForceAwakens wrote:
Desperately need a solution as I have a series of matches lined up from next month.

That’s a tell tale sign that the “force” is not with you.

thats a pretty good article.
Rover wrote:
They say shooting is a "mental game."

I concur with Rover, it’s a mental issue. Here’s an interesting read:

https://www.ssusa.org/articles/2015/8/5 ... 90-mental/

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