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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 2:45 pm 
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For training purposes I'm going to add some weight to my air pistol.
I have read this in a book: add some weight, take a lighter pistol, shift the balance to the muzzle, shift it to the grip.

So, now let's discuss adding some weight. I mean not to balance the pistol but really to train the body.
Maybe a kilo or two? Or 0.5 kilo. I don't know.

I have MP-46M. It weights 1300 grams. My average result is 525.

Could you recommend how much weight should I add to the grip?


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 3:11 pm 
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What are you trying to achieve? If it is hold endurance in resistance/strength then you're going the wrong way about things imho.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 3:28 pm 
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SamEEE wrote:
What are you trying to achieve? If it is hold endurance in resistance/strength then you're going the wrong way about things imho.


Well, in the book there is no comment on that. The mechanism of the exercise is: change whatever you can. The trigger weight - less and more. The length of sight line: more and less. Take another pistol. Go to another shooting club. Remove the grip entirely.

This all trains the body and the brain.
You add a new factor to which you are not ready. You train to cope with it. At the competition you definitely have another factor: agitation. Maybe more than one. Shouting of spectators ets. So, be ready to as many new factors as possible.
You disagree?

In my mind adding more weight can help in training:
1) stamina;
2) tremor suppression.

Everything is logical.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 4:19 pm 
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Building stamina can be done in various ways by repetitive exercise routines. I woukd say that this should not be done in the middle of a competitive season, but rather well before the season begins.

I would also look at how well the grip fits your hand. Perhaps some simple modifications might help.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 4:46 pm 
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Pheyden wrote:
I would also look at how well the grip fits your hand. Perhaps some simple modifications might help.



I can't catch your idea. How is it connected with the topic?


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:32 pm 
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I can understand adding weight temporarily for training purposes to build stamina and muscle tone in the arm.

I can't see how adding weight to the grip will help with trigger control or steadying the gun, especially if it is a temporary measure for training. When I went from an IZH-46 to a Hammerli 480K2 I had a difficult time controlling my shots with the lighter Hammerli. I was use to the heavier barrel weight of the IZH dampening things out. While I have trained with the lighter weight Hammerli, I suspect that if I added weights in a more permanent fashion towards the front of the barrel this would increase angular inertia and help dampen my movements. Adding the weight to the grip would do little for angular inertia for the same amount of weight because it would be closer to the fulcrum or pivot. The only benefit adding weight to the grip for training purposes would be to increase stamina and arm strength. The same could be accomplished with a dumbell and hold the dumbell like a pistol and draw horizontal and vertical figure eights with it at arms length. This will help with shoulder (deltoid) and bicep strength. To assist with forearm strength, the muscles that hold the gun and pull the trigger I recommend something like the dynaflex or powerball. To help dampen the angular movements of the gun I would concentrate on moving the CG of the pistol forward by adding weight towards the front of the pistol.

If I am wrong, please, someone correct me. This seems like basic Newtonian physics to me. Also please explain why I am wrong if I am. I am always open to learning new things.

Best Regards,

David FInell


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 1:29 am 
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Kifsif wrote:
Could you recommend how much weight should I add to the grip?

None

If you want to increase strength or stamina then strap 500g-1000g ankle weight to each wrist for a few days: not just when shooting but all of the time.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:11 am 
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Overholding excercises are good for building endurance fast. Just try hold together a nice sight picture for 40s X 5 X 3, twice a day for a week, and then 50s X 5 X 3.

It is important to consider that strength is a lesser consideration than resistance power.
Good tone, and cardiovascular fitness is apparently good too; but I can't speak to that.

Kifsif wrote:
words
Everything is logical.

Describing something as logical does not make it logical. So I disagree.

Laslo Antal's book Competitive Pistol shooting has a very good section on fitness. I suggest you hit up a Library and read it. Laslo has passed on now I believe, credit to him on writing a cracking book.
He was a medical doctor, so certaintly knew his stuff on anatomy and fitness.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 3:09 am 
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If you want to learn how to cope with distractions at competitions ask your wife to attend practice sessions, she will soon start talking and tell you you are wasting your time and there are jobs you should be doing around the house and garden. After a few visits you will find any comp a place of peace.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 4:08 am 
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Kifsif wrote:
Well, in the book there is no comment on that.

It would be interesting to know which book and who the author is.

In your mental rehearsal of the match don't just shoot 10s all the way through. Include the odd 9, malfunctions, disturbances etc.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 6:08 am 
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Quote:
It would be interesting to know which book and who the author is.


The outhor: Dr. Laslo Antal
Title: Competitive Pistol Shooting

https://www.google.no/search?q=laslo+an ... nDuI7lHV_M:


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 6:15 am 
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northpaw wrote:
Quote:
It would be interesting to know which book and who the author is.


The outhor: Dr. Laslo Antal
Title: Competitive Pistol Shooting

https://www.google.no/search?q=laslo+an ... nDuI7lHV_M:

I was talking about the book that suggested changing everything that you can.

I knew Laslo fairly well and, while I may be wrong, I would be surprised if he would have suggested that.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 1:47 pm 
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David Levene wrote:
Kifsif wrote:
Well, in the book there is no comment on that.

It would be interesting to know which book and who the author is.


Russian books. Several. For example, by Itkis.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moisei_Itkis

I'll try to translate:

"Applying weight to the weapon develops the ability to work without fatigue and any deterioration in quality of the shooting. Applying weight contributes to more vivid muscular sensation as the degree of muscle tension changes and, therefore, to some extent improves the conditions for manipulating the muscles. Similar state can be observed also if the habitual weight of the weapon lowers".

And so on and so forth. Several well known Russian coaches who wrote the books. They all say about contributing to stamina and elements of novelty to muscular sensations.

So, why not.

Well, such books can be found in the internet free of charge. If somebody needs them, I can help in finding them. But they are all in Russian, of course. So, nothing to discuss here, I think.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 4:05 pm 
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I'd say, keep on training with the 46M. That is ample training. Patrick Haynes suggested some hold exercices on his targetshooting.ca website, check it out.


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