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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 11:45 am 
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Recently in a high school air rifle match, a shooter accidently ran air through his gun with no pellet during prep time. He was penalized at the end of the round citing that a shot must not be fired using a cease fire. Was this a just enforcement of the rule and does cycling air constitute a shot?

Thanks for helping,

Glenn


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 11:58 am 
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Location: Ruislip, UK
If you were shooting under ISSF rules then it depends on the stage of the match.

If it was after "Athletes to the line" but before the combined Preparation and Sighting time then only dry firing and aiming exercises are allowed. Releasing the propelling charge during that time would get you a warning for the first violation. Each subsequent violation would get a 2 point deduction from the lowest valued of the first 10 match shots.

If it was during the combined Preparation and Sighting time then there should have been no penalty.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 12:04 pm 
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They use NRA rules. The rule was 14.5 on PG 44. The boy was in prep time of the prone portion of a 3P match. They are allowed to dry fire, but cannot send pellets down range into the sighters or otherwise.

It caused them to lose the title by 1 point.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 1:00 pm 
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Location: Ruislip, UK
Sorry, can't help with NRA rules.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 2:01 pm 
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Location: Valencia County 4-H, NM USA
gmucha wrote:
They use NRA rules. The rule was 14.5 on PG 44. The boy was in prep time of the prone portion of a 3P match. They are allowed to dry fire, but cannot send pellets down range into the sighters or otherwise.

It caused them to lose the title by 1 point.

Are you SURE they are using NRA Rules? most high school events are run under CMP rules.

CMP rules closely follow "OLD" ISSF rules and expelling gas ... Air/CO2 is a shot. I'm pretty sure NRA follows suit. There is no combined prep & sighter ... separate stages.

Here is the CMP Rule:
7.15.1 Shots Fired Before the Command START
A shot fired before the command START for a Preparation and Sighting or Sighting Stage must be scored as a miss on the first competition shot.

The NRA Rule:
14.5 Early or Late Shots - If any shots are fired before the command to “COMMENCE FIRING,” or after the command to “CEASE FIRING,” the shots of highest value equal to the number fired in error will be scored as misses.

I've seen it happen during prep for a Final by a world class shooter.

They made the correct decision, you can ONLY cycle air after the fire command has been given.
Most CO2 & sporter guns do not have a dry fire switch.
Many "Precision", Olympic style guns now have a dry fire switch, but you better be darned sure how it works if you are dry firing in a prep period.

If you expel gas (no pellet) after your records are complete or stop ... w/o the range officer telling you it's OK to do so, that is an extra shot.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 2:48 pm 
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Thanks. It's the purple NRA rule book. They shoot the high end Anschutz, FWB, and Walther guns. He thought he had the safety engaged but was mistaken. It happens. I bet he will never do that again. Anyone else on the team could have shot another point or 2.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 3:01 pm 
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Location: Montreal, Canada
gmucha wrote:
Recently in a high school air rifle match, a shooter accidently ran air through his gun with no pellet during prep time. He was penalized at the end of the round citing that a shot must not be fired using a cease fire. Was this a just enforcement of the rule and does cycling air constitute a shot?

Thanks for helping,

Glenn


Was the "shot" during prep time as you say in the first part of your message, or was it during a "cease fire" as you also say?

I think that would make a big difference. I must admit that I don't know the ISSF rules well, but at the two clubs I shoot at, when they call a "cease fire" you are supposed to safe your gun (open the cocking lever) and step back from the firing line.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 10:21 pm 
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It was during 3 minute prep time when dry firing is allowed. No pellet was discharged, just air. It was not a cease fire during the shooting time for a record score. I think my confusion comes fromantic the definition of a shot. It's is discharging a projectile only or does a shot include cycling air through the gun with out a pellet.

This area uses NRA rules to govern high school matches.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 10:27 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 2:49 pm
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Location: Valencia County 4-H, NM USA
gmucha wrote:
It was during 3 minute prep time when dry firing is allowed. No pellet was discharged, just air. It was not a cease fire during the shooting time for a record score. I think my confusion comes fromantic the definition of a shot. It's is discharging a projectile only or does a shot include cycling air through the gun with out a pellet.

This area uses NRA rules to govern high school matches.
Where are you at? No JROTC programs near you?


Think of it in a firearms example ... a shot is a discharge of the propellant, it just has both gas & the projectile.
A shot in airgun is when the propelling charge is expelled ... just as in smallbore ... the fact that the pellet is not included is irrelevant.

If you happened to load a blank in smallbore and touched it off ... that too is a shot.
Both these have "something" coming out the bore.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 7:43 pm 
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Joel, here all the matches are nra rules except the jr olympic qualifier (usas/issf) and the cmp state championship.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:33 pm 
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Location: USA
Trying to help clarify, the release of just air is not the same as the release of air and pellet before match firing begins.

ISSF rules (6.11.2): David Levine was correct above about warning for 1st time, then two-points penalties are accessed. USAS has same rule.

National Standard Three-Position Air Rifle Rules (7.11): same as ISSF. CMP rules: There are none for 3P air rifle. Suspect writer was referring to the National Standard Rules.

NRA rules: Reference was made to rule 14.5. – “If any shots are fired before the command to ‘COMMENCE FIRING,’ or after the command to ‘CEASE FIRING’ the shots of highest value equal to the number fired in error will be scored as misses.” BUT also, see 14.4 – “Any release of the propelling charge, after the first competition target [/u]is in place, without the pellet hitting the target, whether a pellet has been loaded or not, will be scored as a miss.” Note 'after first competition target is in place' (not sighting target). Fun time for the jury.


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